[TimpZ]

I'd like to argue for the blanket rule to be reconsidered regarding IL times extracted from Egg Shuttle. If you start without boost, there's literally no difference. Especially the first stage, Tropical Resort 1, suffers zero difference. Therefore, I'd like to argue that if you have a recording of your stat, to prove you didn't start with boost, that it should be submittable.

[CriticalCyd]

I agree with this honestly. Video proof would indeed be required to make sure, but I think it should be allowed.

[SpinDashMaster]

Times maybe, scores and rings hell no.

[TimpZ]

Obviously I'm talking solely about times. I know that score and rings carry over, though if you start the zone with 0 rings I think you can see the separate score for the level in question. This is nothing I've noted however.

The reason I'm bringing it up is because while doing score or ring attacks like this would be non-sensical, there is quite a lot of times I've gotten an IL-time PB during Egg Shuttle runs (when starting with no boost), but I can't submit it because of the rules.

One thing however, if you start with rings and get hit before getting more in the level, that should also void the stat since you'd technically be dead otherwise.

Though that raises the question of how when starting with, say, 100 rings, getting hit then accidentally picking some of them up because there are so many, then continuing and getting hit again should be ruled.

It's a bit unlikely but possible none the less. So after hearing more about what people think of it, I'll just argue for the very first act at least. Then we can build on it from there.

[SpinDashMaster]

This is just too hairy to touch. Like, this is hairier than Cruizer on the furriest day of his life.

In order to allow even times from egg shuttle, you would have to not only make sure the boost gauge is completely empty, but also make sure you start with 0 rings (or add some convoluted mess about "don't get hit till you get your first ring").

No thanks.

Regarding TR1, there is already an understanding that players could submit times from Egg shuttle to that stage. We just never had to bring it up because most players prefer just doing TR1 from the menu.

[Parax]

^ Yeah, basically what SDM said is my thoughts on it. I guess we can add an exception for TR1, but I'm not touching the rest of it.

[TimpZ]

So you agree that if you start with no boost and 0 rings in a level, then it makes no difference? In that case, I don't see why you couldn't extend the rule of allowing TR1 to time attacks of other levels, given you do have a video to prove it.

[SpinDashMaster]

Frankly, we don't feel like it.

Yes, this would be a great ruling if it were just for you, TimpZ. As much as we would like to tailor the rules to suit your wants regarding Egg Shuttle, there's too much potential for nooblets to fuck this up, and I don't want to have to end up voiding stats -just- because they happened to have a sliver of boost or a ring floating in his counter, and/or they "forgot to record," which causes all the current admins to ragequit again and me to usurp power (bahahahah).

The rules are aimed to be concise and simple for both the players and those of us verifying stats, not fine-tuned to a particular player's requests.

[TimpZ]

Not wanting to do it because of reasons like you listed is one thing. Trying to ridicule me for a legitimate suggestion just makes you look like a jerk and has no place in an adult discussion.

[Gpro]

Okay, so I'm reading this because it's a thing. I like TimpZ's idea, and while I can see the point as to why it shouldn't be allowed, I can also see why it could be.
Taking something out of consideration because someone MIGHT mess things up is more excuse than legitimate reasoning. It's the pure reason why you remind the newbies to read the rules (which is already put in place at the submissions thingy, if I'm not mistaken).

Pro tip: Being a jerk isn't nice

[Thorn]

TimpZ, we literally just had an argument like this.

What I'm saying is, if you're gonna use an emulator for competition, why allow the use of one that allows for TASing, memory watch/editing and LUA-scripting as basic functions when very much viable alternatives exist?

In this situation, the question is, "What I'm saying is, if you're gonna have competition, why allow the use of a mode that allows for starting a level with rings and boost when a viable alternative exists in the form of just choosing the level from the area maps?" When we make BS calls, my first instinct is to get a screen capture of the Records screen to show it was earned in some fashion (even if illegitimate) and not a typo, and allowing Egg Shuttle means that people can simply say they used the Shuttle and thus don't have the level time/score saved. I know you're all for having the stat recorded in-game, as you posted here saying you'd like screen shots of console stats as proof; this allows you to get that shot at anytime.

tl;dr the things you are asking for here contradict views you've expressed recently, so it looks self-serving, and we're keeping Egg Shuttle individual levels banned for the reasons you expressed in those prior views. I expect to hear how this situation isn't exactly the same, as it's not about deliberate cheating, so I'll say in advance that it's more than similar enough in the context I used.

SpinDashMaster: Since when do you void stats? That's some of the most egregious backseat adminning I've seen out of you yet, and your attitude's starting to piss other members off instead of just me. Cool it.

[TimpZ]

I never said I was angry, I said you were acting like a jerk with childish comments not relevant to the topic in question. Also I'm confused as to what part about me suggesting new rules, in order to make competition easier (although possibly for a minority), and then requesting on feedback and opinions makes me be "on a high horse" or asking for rules to be "fine-tuned to a particular player's requests". Obviously my experiences are based on personal observations, that doesn't make me self-centered.

Thorn, I fail to see how recorded videos of gameplay from Egg shuttle has anything to do with rendered videos from TASing emulators. When writing the first post, I mainly thought about TR1 and made a suggestion about extending that to other levels to see what the community thinks about it. After realising about the potential problems with rings, I brought that up without bias.

It is true that Colours can be emulated and TASed. But doing so through Egg shuttle would be unreasonable if anything and banning Egg shuttle times doesn't protect the game from TASing on normal time attacks like Supersonic917 showed. Never did I suggest anything but total transparency from the stat claimer for this type of stats in form of full videos.

[Parax]

Removed off-topic shitposts. Probably a good idea not to make those.

I've updated the rule to add an exception for Tropical Resort 1, and that's as much as I'm willing to change here. This can get really messy and confusing far too easily.